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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
Infinity Ziona
Cloakers
12
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Posted - 2013.05.22 15:47:00 -
[1] - Quote
This is cool. So with ISBoxer I could have 10 accounts running 10 snipe BS or those new attack BC snipers and it'll lock and fire all my ships on some poor war target , blowing him to little tiny bits in two clicks of the mouse?
Edit: thinking of this functionality if my ships are separated by distance and there's a neutral ship near my target isn't there a big possibility that I might lock the neutral ship, or does ISBoxer have some AI where it automatically locks the same ship my primary account locks?
Edit 2: nm it uses overview of course. Long as they are set up the same it locks same. |
Infinity Ziona
Cloakers
15
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Posted - 2013.05.22 19:17:00 -
[2] - Quote
Ginger Barbarella wrote:Anyone care to bet on whether IsBoxer will suddenly be made against EULA
If that happens I will unsubscribe the 9 accounts I just signed up for. 10 ship Exequror sniper gang coming up. |
Infinity Ziona
Cloakers
16
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Posted - 2013.05.23 07:55:00 -
[3] - Quote
rswfire wrote:Infinity Ziona wrote:Ginger Barbarella wrote:Anyone care to bet on whether IsBoxer will suddenly be made against EULA If that happens I will unsubscribe the 9 accounts I just signed up for. 10 ship Exequror sniper gang coming up. Please do. Playing ten characters simultaneously and in synchronization is, imo, cheating. It's extra DPS from one player using one command. I have just as many accounts as you and I do not use multiboxing software. I also find it rather annoying to see 20 mining characters in a belt being controlled by a single person in an NPC corp. I think most people intuitively find people who use this software to be (insert expletive). CCP really should make it against the EULA, but for whatever reason, they haven't...so enjoy your advantage and feel awesome because you've created a 10x multiplier for each command you use.
What's the difference between 10 players trying to kill me and me with 10 accounts trying to kill them? Still 10 accounts on each side. I say they're cheating cause they have an advantage still. They should be nerfed. |
Infinity Ziona
Cloakers
18
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Posted - 2013.05.23 22:46:00 -
[4] - Quote
Roime wrote:Infinity Ziona wrote:
What's the difference between 10 players trying to kill me and me with 10 accounts trying to kill them? Still 10 accounts on each side. I say they're cheating cause they have an advantage still. They should be nerfed.
Difference is that they are playing the game as it was designed, and their success depends on teamwork, experience and execution. Your success depends on a third party program controlling game clients on your behalf, enabling actions that would be impossible to execute by a single player without the third party program. What's the difference between a player recording an action and his botting program repeating it 10 times, and you performing an action and your ISbotting program repeating it 10 times?
No their success depends on having 10 accounts. Same as mine. The difference between your two scenarios is in one a person is making the decision to fire on a target vs a computer algorithm mindlessly activating an attack based on a set of predetermined variables. |
Infinity Ziona
Cloakers
18
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Posted - 2013.05.24 05:07:00 -
[5] - Quote
rswfire wrote:Infinity Ziona wrote:No their success depends on having 10 accounts. Same as mine. The difference between your two scenarios is in one a person is making the decision to fire on a target vs a computer algorithm mindlessly activating an attack based on a set of predetermined variables. This isn't true. I have 10 accounts. And I cannot control them in the same manner as you without using botting software, which I would not do. It's just that simple. You have a 10x multiplier for every attack you make. I don't know why this is even disputed. It's just a simple fact. Whether you agree with using this software or not, why deny this? If I had a fleet of 10 people, they would not respond exactly as you because it's 10 humans instead of 1. In that scenario, many people say the humans would have the advantage; I don't know as I've not fought a fleet of botters. I've watched people use this software to clean out belts, to quickly rat, etc. I've never actually seem it used in combat. Some scenarios are okay to me, some not. In general though, I just see it as cheating. You're not individually controlling each of your characters; to me, that's just intuitively wrong. I welcome that we don't all agree on this and you're welcome to your point of view and I'm not trying to attack you in any way.
I use a wireless mouse and keyboard and have my PC attached to a large screen high res LCD TV. The mouse and keyboard communicate though an IR dongle. Would you agree that when I click on my weapons to fire I am doing so manually. Now what if I have 10 computers one wireless mouse and keyboard and 10 IR dongles? I'm running 10 characters. When I click my weapons the signal is sent to all 10 dongles and all my accounts fire. I'm still manually firing.
IRBoxer is the same. I can't get it too do anything automated without braking EULA. All I can do is replicate exactly my mouse clicks. If I have 5 snipers, a tackler, and a couple off RR and I set my tacklers to orbit all my ships will attempt to orbit. Not good. I can only do very basic things like fire. With some smart setup of module placement I can get my ships to activate scram, web, nuets, and fire simultaneously but it's nowhere near the capability of 10 real pilots whose ships can behave independently of eachs others GUI. |
Infinity Ziona
Cloakers
19
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Posted - 2013.05.24 05:38:00 -
[6] - Quote
rswfire wrote:Infinity Ziona wrote:I use a wireless mouse and keyboard and have my PC attached to a large screen high res LCD TV. The mouse and keyboard communicate though an IR dongle. Would you agree that when I click on my weapons to fire I am doing so manually. Now what if I have 10 computers one wireless mouse and keyboard and 10 IR dongles? I'm running 10 characters. When I click my weapons the signal is sent to all 10 dongles and all my accounts fire. I'm still manually firing.
IRBoxer is the same. I can't get it too do anything automated without braking EULA. All I can do is replicate exactly my mouse clicks. If I have 5 snipers, a tackler, and a couple off RR and I set my tacklers to orbit all my ships will attempt to orbit. Not good. I can only do very basic things like fire. With some smart setup of module placement I can get my ships to activate scram, web, nuets, and fire simultaneously but it's nowhere near the capability of 10 real pilots whose ships can behave independently of eachs others GUI. Everything you said is true and I don't disagree with it. You do have to keep your setups exact or be pretty creative in your placement of modules. That's why I say it's a 10x multiplier. As for the first paragraph, at first I thought it was leading in the same direction a lot people argue ("but what if I had 10 computers?") I can't really argue with what you said; it is technically sound, and therefore not disputable. It still doesn't make it right though, imho. I do see this as cheating, but it's just my personal point of view. For you, it's obviously not. We'll never agree as a result because there's just no middle ground on this subject, and that's okay. It's sanctioned activity so you're automatically on the winning side of this argument.
I actually do agree with you. I consider it "cheating" as well. I'm more playing devils advocate. In a game where cheating is frowned upon I wouldn't use it. In my earlier days in EvE I wouldn't' have even considered it but I don't take EvE very seriously as a competitive game. EvE is a game where "cheating" is rife and applauded. You either "cheat" or as its referred to "metagame" harder but within the defined rules or you don't get anywhere imo.
Examples of EvE metagaming
alt scouts
old school neutral RR
OGB
Lofty scam
Invite to fleet with wars active
Logoffski
Log on traps
Invite spamming
list goes on and on... you know what they say if you don't use it you lose it. |
Infinity Ziona
Cloakers
21
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Posted - 2013.05.24 15:50:00 -
[7] - Quote
Lady Areola Fappington wrote:The never ending argument!
It's amusing how I can register 30 different accounts, then use software to perform a parallel replication of commands, netting me (in this example), 30 ore holds of ice after a set amount of time. That's cool.
But, if I take one account, and perform a serial replication of commands to gather the same 30 ore holds of ice, that's botting.
Now3, before you say the second example is "program making decisions", no. I'm talking about simple replication of commands. All I'm doing is trading numbers for time.
I believe it's more to do with inability to police it. I mean should you get banned for managing to replicate a number of account inputs at the same time? When? How many accounts? Two? What if your using two PCs and two mice and both hands? 5? What if you have taped up some contraption to mechanically manipulate the mice? Is that ban worthy ? If they ban ISBoxer then what if you instead use my method and have a wireless mouse and keyboard and multiple IR receivers? How do you detect these things? Everything happens at the same time? How do handle software that randomly assigns delay? Ad nauseam.
The only reliable way to avoid banning people accidentally and avoid being swamped with suspect multiboxer like petitions is a) limit each IP to one account (revenue hit + easily worked around) or b) allow multi boxing.
Go after the bots that don't respond while being active is a much better option IMO.
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